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Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 7:04 pm
by TheCatt
Let's do another "don't look it up" poll.
What percent of the workforce do you think works for the federal government? Civilian jobs only (no military)
No cheating, Malcolm.
And, bonus question. Is it more or less than at each of the following decades? (answer per decade): 1950, 1960, 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000.
Edited: to clarify for federal only.
Edited By TheCatt on 1415457062
Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 7:13 pm
by GORDON
All levels of government? I would guess.... 15-20%, and we've got to have more now than ever before.
Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 7:56 pm
by Malcolm
I'll go 1 of every 10 people.
50s: way more than this, gov't wasn't big enough
60s: way more than this, still not big enough
70s: getting closer, lots of new workers needed for idealistic hippie initiatives
80s: getting closer still, due to massive military buildup
90s: somewhere close to now, because we still had cash and no commies to outspend
00s: more workers then than now, because we had seven million bloated "wars" on various abstract concepts and common sense in general AND the cash to fuel them
I presume the economic situation in the past ten years has necessitated a bit of shrinkage.
Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 8:05 pm
by TheCatt
Ack. I should have clarified: FEDERAL government only.
Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:53 pm
by GORDON
TheCatt wrote:Ack. I should have clarified: FEDERAL government only.
Including postal employees? I say 10%.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 7:05 am
by TheCatt
GORDON wrote:TheCatt wrote:Ack. I should have clarified: FEDERAL government only.
Including postal employees? I say 10%.
From what I can tell, yes, USPS employees count as federal employees.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 7:49 am
by thibodeaux
What about military? (I'd say yes, active duty only, no reserves or guard)
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 9:30 am
by TheCatt
thibodeaux wrote:What about military? (I'd say yes, active duty only, no reserves or guard)
Civilian only.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:10 am
by GORDON
TheCatt wrote:GORDON wrote:TheCatt wrote:Ack. I should have clarified: FEDERAL government only.
Including postal employees? I say 10%.
From what I can tell, yes, USPS employees count as federal employees.
There are those who argue that USPS workers don't count, because their budget is somehow not tied to the federal budget (and that is why you can't use the USPS as an example of how the government can bring in record amounts of tax money but can't keep post offices open).
I don't make those arguments, but some do.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:13 am
by TheCatt
At any rate... I think I would have guessed 5-10%, and probably higher than any decade except the 90s and 2000s.
Lowest since 1962 in absolute terms.
Lowest since WWII in % terms, around 2% of workers.
Local and state government, however, growing massively:
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:25 am
by GORDON
So, more people overall, but fewer as a percentage of total population?
And why don't military count? Their checks come from the treasury.
Edited By GORDON on 1415460370
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:55 am
by TheCatt
GORDON wrote:So, more people overall, but fewer as a percentage of total population?
And why don't military count? Their checks come from the treasury.
Fewest people overall since 1962.
Cuz those aren't the #s aren't included in what the WSJ was counting.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:48 am
by GORDON
What the hell were all these federal employees doing in 1962? There was no department of education, NSA, homeland security, etc.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:52 am
by TheCatt
GORDON wrote:What the hell were all these federal employees doing in 1962? There was no department of education, NSA, homeland security, etc.
Maybe things like the IRS that have been computerized?
Also, this count does not include federal contractors. So the #s may be misleading.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 12:01 pm
by GORDON
Hmmm.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 3:27 pm
by thibodeaux
TheCatt wrote:Also, this count does not include federal contractors. So the #s may be misleading.
My first guess is shenanigans with counting. Like, the janitor in the federal building in 1962 was probably a federal employee, but now he's an employee of a contractor.
Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 3:58 pm
by TheCatt
Here's an estimate around 11 million.
When he added up all the numbers, he found that the true size of the federal government was about 11 million: 1.8 million civil servants, 870,000 postal workers, 1.4 million military personnel, 4.4 million contractors, and 2.5 million grantees
Including active duty military.
Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 4:49 pm
by Vince
Part of the rise in local government jobs is in part due to federal regulations from my understanding. Some the feds help pay for, but they're still federally created jobs, even if they're being shouldered by the local government.