Welcome to Thunderdome

Here's why I didn't like it:

1. Professor X has a degenerative brain disease (brilliant!), but his mutant power is strong as ever. Meanwhile, Logan, who has been alive for centuries thanks to his healing factor, is rapidly being killed by the adamantium on his skeleton because his healing factor is losing that battle? What? He might be older than Charles, but physically he's far, far younger, so why would his mutant power be fading while Charles' is going strong? No consistency there.
2. Let's say it is fading naturally or even thanks to the adamantium. It still goes from A to Z really, really fast. The progression makes no sense. Yeah, the metal did nothing to him for decades, but all of a sudden it kills him in a matter of two days. Again, no consistency.
3. Let's say the previous two points are stuff we can ignore. When he injects himself with the serum, he'd be completely healed. That's what a healing factor does... Remember when he stood in front of the fucking Phoenix who made men dissolve to nothing in less than a second and his healing power was strong enough to keep him intact? No consistency!!!!! Once he's healed, he's healed. His poisoning by the adamantium would reset. It'd go back to square one and his healing factor wouldn't be fighting it as hard. All those decades of slowly poisoning him wouldn't automatically refresh once the serum wore off.
4. Go take a steel pipe and hit a steel bar. What happened? You just made a loud clang and probably vibrated the shit out of your hands, right? Guess what would happen if you shot a plate of adamantium with an adamantium bullet? It'd just bounce off.
5. But, for fun, let's say it did blow away a huge chunk of X-24's skull, how would that stop his healing factor? It wouldn't. Wolvie has regenerated from a single blood cell in the books... Point being, maybe that'd make part of his head vulnerable, but it wouldn't kill him.
6. X-24 was the worst part of the movie by a mile.
7. So we live with the world's greatest mutant tracker, and the bad guys keep finding us, but let's go have dinner with this nice family because I'm sure everything will work out for them.
8. Metal scrap, full of holes, blocks brain waves...ok...
9. Those magical Ibuprofen pills sure do have mixed results.
10. X-24 killing Chuck made zero sense. Why sneak in then cause a scene? He could have easily taken X-23 (Laura) without anyone knowing she was gone. From some of the analysis I've seen, people are speculating that X-24 represented the monster Logan could have become without Chuck. Fair enough, but it still only justifies this as a character stunt and not critical to the story.
11. Magento and a handful of other X people could have easily and permanently cured Wolverine.

I'll stop there, but damn this was a disappointment.

11. It was strongly suggested Charles killed the core Xman team in West Chester, when he had his first episode. I assumed that meant Magneto... unless he just died of old age at some point.

In the comics, wolvie does the killing.

Moved this as I didn't see the point of having it in the non-spoiler thread.

GORDON wrote: SPoiler follows.

He had mutant alzheimers. The fact that he was no longer himself is kind of the point of the whole thing.

He had a mental disorder, but it was never stated by name. Was it? Based on the symptoms, it seemed more like dementia.

As for the second sentence there, I don't really know what you're referring to...?

GORDON wrote: 11. It was strongly suggested Charles killed the core Xman team in West Chester, when he had his first episode. I assumed that meant Magneto... unless he just died of old age at some point.

Fair enough, although Magneto was never really an X-Man when Chuck was around. Granted, the movie universe could be different. Still, his killing, and they never say that he actually killed anyone, of 6-7 core members doesn't account for the thousands more around the world. Many of which could have healed Wolvie.

Let me fill in the gap for you: Chuck was hooked up to Cerebro at the time. So he was linked into every mutant on the planet when he had his episode. He killed them all at once. Something never mentioned in the movie, and you'd think they would because "M-Day" is an actual story line in the books.

That still doesn't explain why Wolvie survived and all the other mutants with healing factors didn't, particularly ones without adamantium also poisoning them at the same time... It also wouldn't explain why all the other telepaths and those invulnerable to telepathic attack, including Magneto and his helmet, are also dead.

Malcolm wrote: In the comics, wolvie does the killing.

That is another massive disappointment. Instead of adapting Old Man Logan, and I don't blame them for that because it involves characters they don't have the rights to, they instead had Hollywood screenwriters clearly unfamiliar with the source material write a story about getting old. I guess they figured it was essentially the same thing?

Again, I LOVED the acting. I cannot say enough about the performances. I just found the story to be shit. I think they have no respect for the source material, and their lack of attention to detail proves it. This story was rushed. Ditto for the R rating, which the movie did NOT have until Deadpool blew up. That caused re-writes, which is why the cursing felt forced. LOVED the violence though. About time he got to do that. I mean, it's been 10 fucking movies.

Leisher wrote: Something never mentioned in the movie, and you'd think they would because "M-Day" is an actual story line in the books.

Fox isn't thinking that far ahead. Also, given how badly they fucked the "Age of Apocalypse" story line, I don't trust them with anything else.

Leisher wrote: Moved this as I didn't see the point of having it in the non-spoiler thread.

GORDON wrote: SPoiler follows.

He had mutant alzheimers. The fact that he was no longer himself is kind of the point of the whole thing.

He had a mental disorder, but it was never stated by name. Was it? Based on the symptoms, it seemed more like dementia.

As for the second sentence there, I don't really know what you're referring to...?

The entire movie was predicated on the fact Charles was losing it, and Logan was hiding him way out in the middle of nowhere where he couldn't hurt anyone.... and couldn't be found. I'm not entirely sure how the timeline went from "Charles has an episode" to "all mutants, everywhere, gone," but we got what we got.

As to the part where you describe major problems with this story because of things that came before in the comic books, the movie literally addresses that when Logan has a handful of those exact reference materials and says something to the effect of, "These are bullshit, half of it didn't happen at all, and half of what's left was exaggerated."

Leisher wrote: Moved this as I didn't see the point of having it in the non-spoiler thread.

I didn't know when I made the post there was already a spoiler thread, and I was on my phone so I couldn't really fix it at the time.

Word.

Logan and Charles even had their out... the boat was almost bought, they were inches away from it.... and they decided, instead, to help some kids. That was great.

About the "adamantium poisoning," I wonder how much of that had to do what was done to him in the previous Logan movie where the Japanese guy somehow took away his healing factor with a robot squid. That made ZERO sense to me at the time, but fuck it... if we were required to accept THAT, I don't see why we can't accept heavy metal poisoning after 50-some-odd years. STranger things have happened.... like little robot squids that take away your ability to heal.

GORDON wrote: The entire movie was predicated on the fact Charles was losing it, and Logan was hiding him way out in the middle of nowhere where he couldn't hurt anyone.... and couldn't be found. I'm not entirely sure how the timeline went from "Charles has an episode" to "all mutants, everywhere, gone," but we got what we got.

I still don't understand how you were making a contradiction or point about my original post in the non-spoiler thread by pointing out Charles' status? That's what I had been asking.

GORDON wrote: As to the part where you describe major problems with this story because of things that came before in the comic books, the movie literally addresses that when Logan has a handful of those exact reference materials and says something to the effect of, "These are bullshit, half of it didn't happen at all, and half of what's left was exaggerated."

Fine, but the problem with that is none of my 11 points above have anything to do with stuff that happened in the books, so... Also, wouldn't that be a deus ex machina, and thus, considered bad writing?

GORDON wrote: Logan and Charles even had their out... the boat was almost bought, they were inches away from it.... and they decided, instead, to help some kids. That was great.

You and I might have seen different movies. In the version I saw, they didn't have the required amount of money. That's why Logan accepted the job in the first place. She convinced him with the promise of $50K and was giving him $20K up front.

He didn't have the money BEFORE his limo was beat to hell. Remember when he called the dealer and got hung up on after offering $30-40K less than asking? Aside from helping Laura, how exactly was he going to get the rest of the money since his limo business was assuredly fucked?

GORDON wrote: About the "adamantium poisoning," I wonder how much of that had to do what was done to him in the previous Logan movie where the Japanese guy somehow took away his healing factor with a robot squid. That made ZERO sense to me at the time, but fuck it... if we were required to accept THAT, I don't see why we can't accept heavy metal poisoning after 50-some-odd years. STranger things have happened.... like little robot squids that take away your ability to heal.

What you're doing here is called "Trying to win a No Prize." (It's a Marvel Comics thing.) You're trying to explain logic holes in the story for the film maker (writers). That's fine, but the logic still doesn't work.

First of all, The Wolverine had a series of logic problems of its own. The biggest being the adamantium shattering so easily at the end. That shit was dumb and goes against the rules of the comic AND the Fox X universe.

Secondly, I could buy the squid thing if it hadn't already been negated in The Wolverine.

Third, even if we buy the squids, it still wouldn't explain how 50 years old damage (or even however many since The Wolverine) would magically reappear after the serum wore off. The shit's already been healed!! It can't "unheal"! That's like someone getting shot, having emergency surgery to remove the bullet, and then 3 years later they sudden die from the wound reappearing bullet and all. It made no sense.

It was an entertaining film with amazing acting that, unfortunately, did not respect the source material and suffers from giant logic holes.

I completely understand why you loved it. You're a casual fan, and that's really who the movie was made for and by...giant logic holes aside...

To me, this is just more proof that Fox has no idea what they're doing, and we won't get a truly good X film until they give up the rights to Marvel.

To put this another way, to me this is the same debate as the Starship Troopers book vs film one.

You're about to get put on my Foes List.

I truly hope The Dark Tower doesn't make this conversation flip flop.

Leisher wrote: I truly hope The Dark Tower doesn't make this conversation flip flop.

I can't see how that's going to be anything less than a clusterfuck.