Welcome to Thunderdome

Posted: **Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:41 pm**

I did it again! This time it's red.

I was in a freeroll. I rivered two pair, and someone was slow playing a bigger two pair, so Iw as knocked down to 300-something chips early.

Rather than fight it out I threw all-in when I was dealt 7/2 off-suit. I figured that if nobody called I could show for a laugh.

I had a couple callers and ended up rivereing a set of 2's to triple up.

The very next hand I threw all-in with A/4 "sooted" and was called by K/K. I flopped an Ace, he turned a King, and I rivered the nut flush.

People are pretty pissed at me at this point, and I don't blame them.

A few hands later I get a royal flush.

A few hands later I'm dealt K/K and get all-in against a guy who has A/A, and I was knocked out of the tournament.

Finally some justice.

Posted: **Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:04 am**

http://www.cardschat.com/f48/

Sign up for this forum to have access to the password for their weekly Sunday $350 freeroll on FT.

I won't be able to play, as I have to take my daughter to a birthday party.

Here's the details for this week's game. The prize money to player ratio is pretty sweet.

Full Tilt
Tournament #30641984
15:00
$350 in prize money
900 max players

Posted: **Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:03 pm**

I've been getting violated in poker. The holiday weekend was my most profitable period ever (including another $1 freeroll win on Full Tilt). But then Black Monday (my birthday) hit:

I had him all-in on the turn, where I was a 95% favorite to win.

In the two months I've been keeping track, I had never been down for more than a day... until Monday. I've been steadily bleeding chips since then. Last night I had my biggest losing session ever. I found a sucker who called my big opening raise (I had J/J) with 6/8 and hit a straight, to take half my chips ($5). After awhile I realized that he calls just about any all-in pre-flop. He called with crap like A/7 off-suit (usually winning!).
So I shoved with J/J and he ended up with Q/Q, felting me. I rebought and shoved again with J/J, and he had K/K to felt me again.
Then my top two pair lost to someone else (thank goodness) to felt me again.
I managed to make a small comeback (when I shoved with Q/Q and they didn't get cracked, plus a lot of small wins), but man, I lost a bunch.

I played some this morning and had two decent sessions. If I can stick with playing a solid/tight game I'll do OK, but I'm having trouble concentrating. My bankroll has reached a point where I think of it as "extra" so I'm not as careful with it. Plus it's been a crappy week at work.

Edited By Paul on 1196445966

Posted: **Sun Dec 02, 2007 9:20 am**

I'm back on track. Had a good day yesterday, bringing my bankroll to record heights.

For those of you who play, I came upon this website: http://www.poker-edge.com/

They sell something like PokerTracker. But it looks like they offer stats on players who you haven't played yet. That is, you get to see the info they have on other players.

The website also lets you look up the information they have on you. So if you have a $ account, put in your username and see what they have on you. Then you can have them email you the full report for free.

Pretty neat.

Posted: **Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:08 pm**

Interesting site, that. I think I'll have to download and try out that software.

Here's the report it has on me. Basically I'm a slightly better than average player, but a bit too passave pre-flop: once the flop is past I let other players drive the betting more often than not and merely react to them. Especially when I'm on the blind - I fold on the blind even faster than when I'm not on the blind. Which seems odd ... I'll have to pay more attention to that.

TPRJones [fulltilt]

Big Bets Won / 100 hands: N/A
Positive indicates a winning player; negative is a losing player.
VP$IP: 23.7
Shows how tight or loose a player is. Less than 20% is considered tight. Greater than 40% is very loose.
PreFlop Raise%: 6.6
Raising preflop more than 10% is somewhat wild. 5% is average. Less than 3% is passive.
PostFlop Aggression: 1.1
This is the ratio of (bets+raises) to calls. Greater than 2 is aggressive, less than 1 is passive.
Cold Call%: 9.3
Calling 2+ bets "cold" preflop. Numbers greater than 10% show looseness.
Blind Steal Attempt%: 11.1
How often a players raises in late position to "steal" blinds. If number is greater than PreFlopRaise%, he is a stealer!
Fold Small Blind to Steal%: 66.7
How often a player folds his small blind to a steal. If this number is high, you can steal his blind easily.
Fold Big Blind to Steal%: 50
How often a player folds his big blind to a steal. If this number is high, you can steal his blind easily.
Went to Showdown if Flop Seen%: 28
How often a player goes to showdown if he sees a flop. Numbers greater than 35% show a calling station.
Showdown Win%: 50
How often a player wins at showdown. Numbers lower than 50% show weak hands at showdown.

Edited By TPRJones on 1196615419

Posted: **Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:45 pm**

The software is a buggy piece of crap. It crashes regularly and when it's not crashing it's barely working.

That having been said, it's great. I've been playing using it a couple of hours now and I've quadrupled my cash. Using it you know exactly who you can bluff and who you can't, and you know which players to avoid at all costs if they raise. My memory is crap so until now I've only been playing the cards. Now I can play the table. Me likey.

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:31 am**

Here's mine. I can tell that it's not based on many hands. (I don't fold the BB or SM 100% of the time). I did like that the sample hand it showed on the website was one where I won an $18 pot, which is a lot bigger than average for the $.05/$.10 limits I play.

Big Bets Won / 100 hands: N/A
Positive indicates a winning player; negative is a losing player.
VP$IP: 36.8
Shows how tight or loose a player is. Less than 20% is considered tight. Greater than 40% is very loose.
PreFlop Raise%: 15.8
Raising preflop more than 10% is somewhat wild. 5% is average. Less than 3% is passive.
PostFlop Aggression: 2
This is the ratio of (bets+raises) to calls. Greater than 2 is aggressive, less than 1 is passive.
Cold Call%: 0
Calling 2+ bets "cold" preflop. Numbers greater than 10% show looseness.
Blind Steal Attempt%: 33.3
How often a players raises in late position to "steal" blinds. If number is greater than PreFlopRaise%, he is a stealer!
Fold Small Blind to Steal%: 100
How often a player folds his small blind to a steal. If this number is high, you can steal his blind easily.
Fold Big Blind to Steal%: 100
How often a player folds his big blind to a steal. If this number is high, you can steal his blind easily.
Went to Showdown if Flop Seen%: 37.5
How often a player goes to showdown if he sees a flop. Numbers greater than 35% show a calling station.
Showdown Win%: 66.7
How often a player wins at showdown. Numbers lower than 50% show weak hands at showdown.

First off, PokerTracker can give me all these stats and the stats of everyone I've played against based on the hands I've played with them. If you don't have PokerTracker you are missing out (so you should PM me).

I have an add-on to PokerTracker called GameTime+ that will do much the same thing that the Poker-Edge software does. That is, it displays the stats of people you are playing against. If you've never played them before, it pretty much just shows their stats for that session. But if you have played someone before, it uses the old data as well.
It does *not* draw information from pooled database. You only see data on hands that you were a part of.

I'm curious about trying Poker-Edge, as it appears to bring more to the table than GameTime+ (which is too basic to be buggy).

It looks like they charge a monthly fee though. $9.95 per month for my level. I rarely use GameTime as I can get a pretty good feel for the players, so I don't know if it's worth that price.
I know it's "free" if you use their referral to sign up for Bodog, *but* I can get a 30% rakeback if I signed up though other places. I know right *now* that's a deal, but if I move up in stakes, missing out on that would be costly.

Let me check PokerTracker and figure that out...

According to my (8 day old) PokerTracker stats I pay about $33 per month in rake (making thrice that in profit) which means I'd be making $9.90 in rakeback *if* I can keep the same win rate and continue playing the same stakes for the same number of hands per month. So if I took that deal and started playing Bodog instead ofPokerStars, it would be about even money. But if I moved up in stakes, it would be a ripoff. Rake would be substantially more if I moved from $.05/$.10 blinds to $.10/$.25 or $.25/$.50.

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:27 pm**

WARNING: Most poker sites have banned the use of Poker Edge. Poker Edge is on PokerStars banned list and Full Tilt's banned list. While Full Tilt has been ignoring the use of Poker Edge, supposedly some "Full Tilt doesn't care" talk on Poker Edge's website in conjunction with the industry's reaction to the AbsolutePoker fiasco and prompted Full Tilt to start taking measures against it.

So use it while you can. If they find it on your machine I hear they issue a warning. If they find it on your PC a second time they issue another warning. I'm pretty sure it's a "three strikes and you're out" policy.

Edited By Paul on 1196708451

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:37 pm**

Is there anything preventing one from simulating such a thing if they've the know-how to build one?

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 4:52 pm**

Malcolm wrote:Is there anything preventing one from simulating such a thing if they've the know-how to build one?

What do you mean by, "simulating such a thing?"

You are allowed to use software that gives you the odds (IE, odds of hitting a flush, the average payoff of your hold cards pre-flop, etc.).
You are also allowed to use software that logs and displays the data from hands that you've played in. But it can't log or display data from hands that you only observed.

That is, if you sit at a 9 player table and wait 5 hands before posting the blind, then you fold ten hands in a row before quitting, your data would be based on the 10 hands that you were a part of. None of the information that you observed during those five hands that you sat out would be recorded. If it did recored that information it would be considered "data mining" which is not allowed on most sites.
Ditto with opening a full table and just observing the action. Yeah, you can do it, but you're not allowed to have software that records what you see.

So basically Poker Edge collects data from hands that people have played in and puts them into a huge online database. Then you get to see stats on the people that other Poker Edge users have played against. So when you hit a game against strangers, you know that player X always raises post-flop and that player Y only plays good hands. It's a big advantage, especially early in the session.

Hmmm... I wonder if Poker Edge also betrays you by uploading your own info as well?

I think the poker sites can only track programs that they know about. So if someone were to build something similar, it'd probably go undetected.

I know that there are programs that will play poker for you. Since most players online aren't that good, computers tend to be decent winners. I know people would access a second computer via VPN so the poker sites couldn't find the software on the PC.

Regardless any of that behavior could get you banned and your bankroll confiscated.

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:38 pm**

So online casinos work like real casinos in that, not only can I not get caught cheating, I can't even get caught playing intelligently?

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:48 pm**

Paul wrote:Hmmm... I wonder if Poker Edge also betrays you by uploading your own info as well?

Yes if you are using it as a free trial, although once you sign up your data is hidden from everyone.

Last night I played in two cash tourneys, and ended up in the money in both. I can directly attribute my improved play to Poker Edge. In both cases it identified loose and tight players with 100% accuracy, and I ended up stealing far more hands than I actually won with the nuts. At one point it got so that one guy I was up against (a "tight rock" in Poker Edge terms) I completely stopped even looking at my cards and won every pot against him based completely on betting patterns and nothing else. (I mean that literaly, I recall winning more than one hand with 7/2 off not matching the table at all, and at least one hand where I folded big slick pre-flop just because he raised to 3x big blind - something a tight rock only does on KK or AA).

As to that other program, I couldn't ever get it to work right. It crashed my computer every time I tried to use the GameTime+ thingy. And I don't want all those stats, I don't know what they mean. I just want to know if someone is P/P, P/A, A/P, A/A, and whether they've been playing tight or loose. Keep it simple, I'm dumb.

Posted: **Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:03 pm**

Poker Edge had an update today, and I've not had any buggy problems at all. Although I've also stopped using IE on that computer while using PE, too (it uses IE in the background to do God knows what) so it could be that, too.

Edited By TPRJones on 1196733851

Posted: **Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:48 am**

I need to move up in limits.

A 50 minute video tutorial on playing poker at a $.10/$.25. 6-max table. I plan on moving up to that level 2008, assuming things go as planned. I have played the $.25 level before, and did well, but I want to make sure I have a proper bankroll before taking a serious stab at it.

Here's one for a $.50/$1 6-max table.

Posted: **Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:44 pm**

Here's a screen cap of GameTime+ working with Poker Tracker.

If you have enough hands logged against a player, their rating avatar will appear by their stats. I put a copy of the possible ratings in the middle of the table, not that anybody I was playing with has been ranked yet.

If you click on the stats (like I did with Wakeboarrder) you can get more info.

I have a decent seat, with a guy who's only played one out of 30 hands on my right (so I avoid him) and a guy directly to my left who is voluntarily puts money into 53% of the pots.

The guy two to my left has folded 100% of the blind steal attempts... but he's only been put to the test once, so I guess that doesn't mean much. But if I had more hands it might mean something.

EDIT: It looks like I need to tell Poker Tracker to rate the people in its database. It doesn't do it automatically. But I can specify the minimum number of hands before they're rated, and what percentages result in what rating. You can also tell it to base the ratings on the last "x" hands or a time period. That way old stats don't don't mess you up if they've changed their game.

Edited By Paul on 1196919224

Posted: **Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:54 am**

I looked up my transaction history for the past 60 days, and found a "$10 credit purchase" that took place on the final day of my losing streak.

I did *not* made a deposit.

I emailed PokerStars about it this morning and just got a response:

Hello Paul,

Tahnk you for your email.

Transaction # 0112542506 is a 'Full Contact Poker Mission 2 reward credit'.

Then it clicked. The Full Contact Poker forums had a generous freeroll that was advertised on PokerStars. If you were a forum member, and signed up on the FCP site, you could play. I was already a forum member so I followed the link and registered.

I don't think I ever played it. But then they had a "Mission 2" which gave $10 to any registered FCP member who could collect 50 FPP's over the holiday weekend. I did *not* sign up for that, and registration closed a couple days before I noticed it. I was disappointed too, as I estimated that I had close to 50 for that time period. In the back of my mind I wondered if my original registration qualified me for all of those promotions. I guess I did!

That is so awesome.

Posted: **Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:00 pm**

My winning streak ended last night with a $11 loss.
I won a few other games, which more than offset that, but it was still a disappointment.

I was down $16. I made back $13 of that.
Then I was dealt J/J (I soooo hate that hand).
The flop was J/6/6. I could tell form his bet that he was afraid that I had a 6.
The turn was an 8. Again, another cautious bet. I baited him along.
The river was a Queen. and he shoved his last $4 in. I called.
He had Q/Q and I doubled him up. Aaaaaagh!

I was really trying hard to get back even that game, and that blow really hurt and I never got that close again.

J/J hurts me so bad, so often.

Posted: **Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:08 am**

New poker comedy.
Lots of stars.

Posted: **Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:35 pm**

That looks great.

I guess Daniel N. has a good sense of humor since the "genius who lives at home with his mom" is him.

I didn't see Anne Duke though and the poker pro mom/stay at home dad was obviously her.

Posted: **Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:55 pm**

Anybody here play on PokerStars?