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Leisher
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Post by Leisher »

TheCatt wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2024 11:18 am
Leisher wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2024 10:51 am
TheCatt wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2024 10:14 am Well, apparently they don't like going bankrupt.
I think they do though. Otherwise they would have run their business differently and hired competent staff. :D
But they are trying to run it differently, and now you are giving them grief!
I legit do not grasp how people can fly on an airline who treat scheduled departure dates and times as "maybes".
GORDON wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2024 11:40 am 20 years ago I suggested that if the customers really cared about poor service and high prices, they would stop flying until the airlines realized the race to the bottom sucked.

The boycott would have been long over by now and we' d all be flying on feather beds.
I have come to realize that Adam's Smith Invisible Hand did not properly calculate people's stupidity, laziness, and desire to "keep up with the Joneses".
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
Leisher
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Post by Leisher »

It is a weird coincidence.
Also related: If you haven't seen the Tanya Harding sex tape, you should. It's super hot.
It's not. It's gross.
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Post by GORDON »

Good life/bad life.

Wasn't Tanya even a smoker back in the olympics? Doesn't look like she stopped.
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Post by Leisher »

GORDON wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:11 am Good life/bad life.

Wasn't Tanya even a smoker back in the olympics? Doesn't look like she stopped.
She smoked dick based on the video I saw.

The video below is getting brought back up after the latest crash, and it brings up an extremely fair question: Why is diversity important in Air Traffic Control? How does it possibly matter if you're white, black, Jewish, a man, a woman, or anything else. It doesn't. What matters is if you can do the fucking job, and last night it sure looks like the person responsible for local traffic was not able to do that.

I saw a stat that said 3K more qualified air traffic controllers were passed over for being white. Not sure if it's true, but I've seen with my own eyes similar results for public service jobs (cops, firefighters, etc.). Literally skipping the top thousand plus scores to hire the highest [insert not white and/or not male] candidate.

Diversity can absolutely be a strength, but not in all cases and certainly not when your team has unqualified people simply for diversity's sake.
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Post by TheCatt »

We're only allowed to say "Thoughts and prayers" after disasters or tragedies. Or is that only for gun shootings?
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Post by Leisher »

Depends on the shooter.

If they're not a straight, white male, then it gets swept under the rug pretty quickly.
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Post by Leisher »

Remember this? I'm sure it's not relevant.

Image
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Troy
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Post by Troy »

Isn’t that orange guy supposed to be running the TSA, FAA, etc.?

You might be confused at this, seeing as he went on tv and blamed Obama and black people, in general. Gtfo.

Don’t we have open vacancies on major transportation positions like, right now?
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Post by Leisher »

Troy wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:09 pm Isn’t that orange guy supposed to be running the TSA, FAA, etc.?

You might be confused at this, seeing as he went on tv and blamed Obama and black people, in general. Gtfo.

Don’t we have open vacancies on major transportation positions like, right now?
The previous FAA head stepped down on Biden's last day. No idea if the new person has been approved by Congress yet?

I haven't heard Trump talk about this, but if he's just campaigning, yes, that is fucking stupid. Who does that help? Based on what I know of Trump, and the way you're phrasing it, I assume he IS campaigning.

However, I stand by my previous question about hiring practices under Biden (and Obama? And Trump's 1st?) that are coming back into the light after this accident. (See above)

Skin color, gender, sexual orientation, etc. should not be "the" basis for why you get or don't get a job (although, there are ALWAYS exceptions). If more qualified applicants are being skipped over because their demographics don't match what is wanted, not needed, then there is a problem. You can have all the good intentions in the world, but it's still an "ism" and in some cases, including air traffic control, you're putting other people's lives at risk.
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Post by Troy »

I get the DEI thing, it's a main talking populist talking point right now, everyone loves it. Crusade away until you find the browns working all those jobs we don't need them in.

Back in reality of this plane crash though, control tower staff were not staffed with enough federally aviation employees.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2025/01/29 ... faa-report
Last edited by Troy on Thu Jan 30, 2025 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Troy »

Just days before the crash, President Donald Trump enacted a sweeping shake-up of the federal agencies responsible for aviation oversight, removing the administrator of the Transportation Security Administration (TSA), David Pekoske, and eliminating all the members of a key aviation security advisory group.
Eat shit, orange dude.
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Post by Troy »

Most of my criticism here is for Trump being hella racist out the gate as the default, instead of taking a lick of ownership.

An Army blackhawk helicopter flew into a commercial airliner as the airliner was landing with all of its lights on, at a busy airport. Surely this is helicopter pilot error?
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Post by GORDON »

Seemed like it to me, but I heard the tower never verified helicopter received their last instruction.

I bet the 10k passed over white guys are glad they didn't get hired last month.
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Post by GORDON »

The Associated Press obtained a report which showed one air traffic controller was working two positions at the time of the crash.
The person/people responsible for that are certainly fired, possibly going to jail.

Not the person working 2 chairs, the management that allowed it.
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Post by Leisher »

Troy wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 5:08 pm I get the DEI thing, it's a main talking populist talking point right now, everyone loves it. Crusade away until you find the browns working all those jobs we don't need them in.
As opposed to the last four years, which was "I get the DEI thing, it's a main talking populist talking point right now, everyone loves it. Crusade away until you find the straight white males working all those jobs we don't need them in."

My argument is that fighting bigotry with bigotry isn't going to solve bigotry. Doesn't matter who is doing it.

Hire the most qualified person for every job. I don't care if they have a dick, vagina, they're furries, black, white, Asian, or they're literal Smurfs. If qualified people aren't available, why aren't we training people to do the job?

Last time I checked, the government had job training programs. WTF are we training them to do if we have ATC jobs available?
Troy wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 5:15 pm Most of my criticism here is for Trump being hella racist out the gate as the default, instead of taking a lick of ownership.
He should take ownership as the president. That doesn't mean taking blame, but it does mean ensuring it won't happen again. Going on the attack, he's not being a part of the solution. Post/during tragedy or crisis, we really need ALL of our politicians to stop with the rhetoric and attacks on one another. It'll never happen though. This is the system we've allowed to be created. Two parties whose core voters never hold them accountable because voting for the other letter makes you a fascist/snowflake/etc.

We all know he isn't the reason the job isn't staffed, but he must do a realistic "why" investigation and then fix it. Did the person manning that other desk quit in the last 10 days? How long has that job been open? Why weren't there backups? Are we not paying the job enough? Were qualified candidates not hired because their skin color didn't check a box? Why can't they fill these jobs? These questions matter.

And if these things happened while the previous people were in charge, maybe he's right to fire them all? Although, I'm try to figure out why the TSA and aviation security advisory groups matter to an incident that took place under FAA jurisdiction?
An Army blackhawk helicopter flew into a commercial airliner as the airliner was landing with all of its lights on, at a busy airport. Surely this is helicopter pilot error?
Pilot error is a definite factor, but the person in the tower is ultimately responsible. How the chopper pilot did not see the plane is beyond me. The light on the front of a plane is like the sun. He/she could not have been paying attention. Meanwhile, the pilots in the plane wouldn't be able to see the chopper...I don't believe. However, the tower is the one in charge of local traffic. I can't even figure out why they'd have a chopper crossing an active runway even if nobody was coming in for a landing at that very moment.

Oh shit. Anyone know the chopper pilot's name? There's a greater than 0 chance I know him.
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Post by TheCatt »

Trump rails against DEI after DC plane crash, but it doesn't apply to air traffic controllers
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-e ... =118272015

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Post by Leisher »

I need that explained to me. How is that the article title, but the first sentence says the exact opposite?

Headline:
Trump rails against DEI after DC plane crash, but it doesn't apply to air traffic controllers
First paragraph:
President Donald Trump on Thursday claimed, without citing evidence, that diversity, equity and inclusion initiatives for air traffic controllers at the Federal Aviation Administration -- under Democratic presidents -- were partly to blame for the tragic plane and helicopter collision in Washington on Wednesday night.
What?
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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Post by GORDON »

I think the poorly written article by the low-intelligence journalist was being "fact checked" in that first sentence, it wasn't meant to imply bush didn't rail against the ATCs. It can mean two things, as written.

I always heard that ATC was a a job you could get with a high school diploma, and it starts in the 6-figures. I also don't know how in the hell they have a shortage.

Can young people just not stop smoking weed in order to piss clean?
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Post by TheCatt »

The sentence is unwieldy, but does not contradict the headline.

A shorter version:
Trump claimed, without evidence, DEI programs under Dems were to blame.

(later in the article) But these programs did not apply to ATC.
GORDON wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 5:16 am I always heard that ATC was a a job you could get with a high school diploma, and it starts in the 6-figures. I also don't know how in the hell they have a shortage.
Boring + tedious as fuck.
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Post by Leisher »

TheCatt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 8:12 am The sentence is unwieldy, but does not contradict the headline.
As Gordon said, it can read multiple ways. I think we're all right, but that means we're also right that it is a poorly written sentence.
TheCatt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 8:12 am Trump claimed, without evidence, DEI programs under Dems were to blame.
Trump's a dipshit for going immediately there. That's not his job. Leadership isn't to walk in and finger point. It sucks that this is the type of leadership we've had for a long, long time now at every level of government. Leave the finger pointing to the MSM and citizens, and then ultimately whatever investigative agency is responsible.

Speaking of...As a civilian, I do find it interesting that only one of the Black Hawk pilots has been listed so far. The only thing known about the other one, if CNN is correct, is that she's a she. BUT, even if a DEI hire is involved, it doesn't mean that is the reason for the accident.
TheCatt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 8:12 am Boring + tedious as fuck.
True story, but not always. I have three good anecdotes from my time in the service that are based on things that happened in that rapcon.
"Happy slaves are the worst enemies of freedom." - Marie Von Ebner
"It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies..." - Orwell
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