Coronavirus

[GORDON]

SNL is full-on mocking the (lack of) severity of it.

[Leisher]

The current push for "covid amnesty" is insane.

"Hey, we all said and did things that were wrong during the covid pandemic. Let's all let bygones be bygones and move forward."

[GORDON]

"Was I wrong for severing contact with a lifelong friend because they wouldn't get the 3rd booster?"

[Leisher]

So serious questions, and Thib I already know your answer.

Shouldn't there be some investigations into Covid and how it was handled? How numbers were crunched, data analyzed, decisions reached, etc.? How responsible should the government, its agencies, and these big pharma companies be held if they killed people or gave them medical conditions?

At the very least it seems like the response to Covid should be getting studied to prepare for the inevitable next pandemic.

[Cakedaddy]

By who, and to what end? The virus was never about people. It was about political parties, "freedom", etc. There's was no time for rational thought.

"Hey. There's a virus going around and it seems to be killing certain people pretty easily. Like, in big numbers. How about we mask up and try to keep some distance from each other? Not a lot to ask, right?"

"FUUUCCK YOU!!! FREEDOM!!! STUPID DEMOCRAT LOSER! THE NAZIS MADE THE JEWS WEAR MASKS!! FREEDOM AND AMERICA!!!"
"FUUUUCK YOU REPUBLICAN NAZI FOOL!! CAN'T YOU SEE THIS IS THE NEXT BLACK PLAGUE!! WHY DO YOU WANT TO KILL GRANDPARENTS YOU GENOCIDAL FREAK OF NATURE!!"

Again. There was no rational thought and no chance for intelligent thought. You believed what your news channel of choice was telling you, and that was that. And your channel of choice was simply against the other channel.

I swear. If the republicans one day say "The sky is blue", the democrats would be required to say "No it's not". And vise versa. There is no rational though any more. Just 'the opposite of what they say'.

As Liesher has seen, I still wear a mask. If I'm in a space with other people, I wear a mask. I know. MASKS DON'T DO ANYTHING!!. I haven't been sick since before the pandemic started. No cold. No flu. No COVID. No cooties. Nothing. I've NEVER gone a year without at least a cold. But I'm sure it has nothing to do with my mask or that I don't get all up on people when waiting in lines. Also, I'm in the public space A LOT because of the work I do.

But back to your question. A study will be a waste of time/money/effort because the results will be along party lines. Like any study, for everyone you show me, I kind find one that shows the opposite results. *See marijuana for examples.

Had people just put masks on and stood 6 feet away, we might not have needed a 'vaccine' at all. Oh, and don't touch your face until you've washed/sanitized your hands. But you know. FREEDOM!! People have a right to plop their germs on other people if they want to!! It's rude and socially unacceptable for me to walk up to you and loudly belch right in your face. Which really does nothing but smell for about a minute. But it's totally fine for you to walk into a room with the cold and spread/hand it off to everyone in the room. Why is that? Rip a big loud stank ass pre-diarrhea fart in a room, and most people are embarrassed. But give everyone in the office the flu? No big deal. FREEDOM!!

[GORDON]

The people most at risk always had the freedom to voluntarily follow the covid rules. They'd never get sick if they did.

[thibodeaux]

"Hey. There's a virus going around and it seems to be killing certain people pretty easily. Like, in big numbers. How about we mask up and try to keep some distance from each other? Not a lot to ask, right?"
...
Had people just put masks on and stood 6 feet away, we might not have needed a 'vaccine' at all. Oh, and don't touch your face until you've washed/sanitized your hands.

Have you learned NOTHING about this virus? None of this is true. It didn't kill in big numbers (IFR << 1%). Masks don't work. Distancing doesn't work. It is not transmitted from surfaces so touching your face doesn't matter. Etc. It goes without saying that the vaccines didn't work.

But it turns out, WE ACTUALLY DID ALL THOSE THINGS you're saying we didn't do. It's a complete lie that people were "plopping their germs" on others. It's ret-conning by the losers who can't admit they were wrong----are STILL wrong---after three years. See also: strawman.

This virus, though called "novel," isn't something that defies the known rules of virii. Its transmission is more or less the same as the flu. NONE of the bullshit interventions that were forced on us were ever recommended for the flu, and they clearly didn't work for COVID either, because it's an airborne respiratory virus and those things don't work for airborne respirator virii.

[thibodeaux]

Just thinking about this some more. Are you one of those people who believes "If only we had done X, we could have eradicated COVID?"

Listen, you're starting from a flawed premise. COVID was never going to be and will never be eradicated. If you believe the official story, it came from animals. We know that domestic animals are infected with it. There's no "sterilizing" immunity to it (i.e., you can get it multiple times). Therefore, there will never be zero risk of someone getting infected with it. Fantasies of eradicating it, like smallpox or polio, are just fantasies.

What's your endgame?

[TheCatt]

If china leaked COVID, what do they know that we don't that they keep wanting to COVID zero?

[thibodeaux]

I don't know that you need the "if" clause. The question is valid regardless of the origin. But that said: I don't think they do know anything we don't, not when it comes to the desirability of zero-covid. It sounds like authoritarian hell to me. I heartily invite any Americans who think we didn't try hard enough to stamp out COVID to go live in China.

[Cakedaddy]

They'd never get sick if they did.

Yep. Never. Good word to use during an argument. Never and always is easy to achieve.

Thib. There's really no point in talking to you. You are so extreme in your beliefs. Sure. Masks don't work. They only catch 98% of the virus, and since it's not 100%, they don't work. If someone sneezes on a surface, I touch that surface and then itch my eye, there's NO chance I'm getting it. And because a few virus particles were able to cross that 6 foot distance, that's not 100%, so it doesn't work. The things you say just seem so stupid to me. Just because something isn't 100%, doesn't mean it shouldn't be done.

Seriously. "Hey. I don't want to get sick. Could you wear a mask and keep some distance?" Both of you "Fuck you." Awesome.

[GORDON]

The measures they took didn't stop the pandemic. The only way the people "most at risk" we're going to not get it was going to be to isolate. Instead we got half measures that didn't work.

No matter how angry you get, the half measures still didn't work, and the only way the vulnerable were going to evade it was to bubble up.

I wore masks every time I was asked to. Got vaxxed, and boosted, THEN got covid after that. Didn't make a scene about it. But I still knew it was a waste of time. That isn't "fuck you."

[thibodeaux]

The things you say just seem so stupid to me

To the stupid, wisdom seems stupid.

"Hey. I don't want to get sick. Could you wear a mask and keep some distance?" Both of you "Fuck you." Awesome.

If YOU want to wear a mask and keep your distance, go for it. If those things work, they work whether I do it or not. (They don't work). Oh but it's still good if it's not 100%? Well then why does it matter if I do it?

But if you insist on bringing the government in to make me do it, and make my kids wear masks all day long or not associate with friends or play outside, why then yes, FUCK YOU very much.

Also: 98%? Which orifice did you pull that from?

[thibodeaux]

I guess I don't get what your complaint is. If you personally don't want to get sick, it sounds like you've nailed that one. Just wear your mask and live in your bubble. Why do you care what other people do?

If you're complaining about the behavior of others, it's no longer about you personally. Do you still harbor some belief that COVID is the Mega-Death Plague? That we can wipe it out if we Just Mask Harder? I truly do not get it.

[Leisher]

I'm not getting into the debate the three of you are having, but I did want to address a few things you said to me directly:

By who, and to what end?

Ideally, by an unbiased responsible government (so not ours), a CDC not worried about funding (so not ours), medical organizations concerned with truth not money (so not ours), and colleges concerned with truth and teaching it (so not ours). Hell, even the WHO should be involved. But all working together to figure out what went wrong and what didn't. The end would be to prepare properly for the next pandemic. Get to work now figuring out new technologies to be better prepared. Get stockpiles of this stuff into place around the country so it's ready to be given out. Learn how to properly dispense information without making people completely divided since so much "official" information was blatantly shit from the jump. I mean, we all knew the masks were bullshit. "How does this stop a virus when it can't stop a fart?" So sell it as "It's not going to be 100% effective, but it's better than nothing." (That did happen much later in the game after that had already preached them stopping the spread.) All people with any inkling of scientific knowledge were dubious, at best, about the vacs, but being good citizens we just went along with it. Does it help if you get covid? Seems that way. Will it stop the spread? No, and that never made sense. Point being, it shouldn't have been sold that way. Lying, which they KNEW they were doing, was misinformation and opened the door to even more misinformation. It's ok to not have answers, but you have to be honest about that. You cannot tell lies and then try to shift your position later.

"Hey. There's a virus going around and it seems to be killing certain people pretty easily. Like, in big numbers. How about we mask up and try to keep some distance from each other? Not a lot to ask, right?"

Speaking of why there should be investigations... Covid patients were INTENTIONALLY put into assisted livings facilities and nursing homes. I know this took place in MI and NY, but I know it also took place in other states. Who approved this? People died because of this and someone should be held responsible.

I swear. If the republicans one day say "The sky is blue", the democrats would be required to say "No it's not". And vise versa. There is no rational though any more. Just 'the opposite of what they say'.

I could not agree with this more. The political tribes are what is truly destroying this country.

I still wear a mask. If I'm in a space with other people, I wear a mask. I know. MASKS DON'T DO ANYTHING!!. I haven't been sick since before the pandemic started. No cold. No flu. No COVID. No cooties. Nothing. I've NEVER gone a year without at least a cold.

I've got zero issue with folks masking up still...except when they're alone in their car. That shit is just weird.

I've had tons of medical appointments in the past couple years and the continued requirement to wear a mask seems like a no brainer, covid or no covid. "Let's take a building and fill it with sick people, but everyone should walk around breathing the same air and never washing their hands." Why haven't masks been required and hand sanitizing stations everywhere since day one?

Wearing masks like that has been accepted behavior in the Asian world forever and they have proven it greatly reduces transmission of seasonal shit like flus and colds.

The other big issue, and this one is going to be impossible to fix, people need to have the flexibility to stay home when they're sick. But this is a whole other road that I don't want to go down, particularly in this thread.

[thibodeaux]

I've had tons of medical appointments in the past couple years and the continued requirement to wear a mask seems like a no brainer, covid or no covid.

No, it isn't.

Masking has real downsides, particularly in hospital and clinic settings. Masking muffles speech, and irritates skin, noses, cheeks, etc. Masking makes it harder to read emotions and gauge reactions— both for your colleagues, your staff and your patients.

Masking harms patient care for older people who are hard of hearing. It harms people who are acutely short of breath. It harms older people seeking care for suspected stroke (did they suddenly develop facial droop?). It harms women giving birth (forced to mask during contractions— why? they just tested negative anyway). It prevents people from seeing your facial expression. In many cases, harm may be limited to subjective discomfort— but guess what: that is still a harm. Unless masking in hospitals has a clear upside, it has to go.

In terms of efficacy, there are zero high quality studies that universal hospital visitor masking on any important outcome.

This "no brainer" thinking is what has brought us 20 years (and counting!) of TSA idiocy: imaginary benefits with heavy but completely ignored costs.

"Let's take a building and fill it with sick people, but everyone should walk around breathing the same air and never washing their hands."

Can we please stop inventing fake dialogues that literally nobody has had? This is just arguing with a strawman.

Wearing masks like that has been accepted behavior in the Asian world forever and they have proven it greatly reduces transmission of seasonal shit like flus and colds.

Does anybody have ANY evidence of this? If we said this kind of stuff about Jews we would lose our sneaker contracts. Asia is also where these diseases come from...how is it we keep catching those diseases if they've so greatly reduced transmission with their mask magic?

[thibodeaux]

Addendum: I'm as misanthropic as they come, but this idea that we will forevermore treat our fellow man as a biohazard is just NUTS. What is WRONG with you people?

[TheCatt]

China's Covid Zero Plan probably failing.

[thibodeaux]

Why don't they just wear masks? Problem solved!

[thibodeaux]

How's that Asian Mask Magic working out?













Totally makes sense to get boosters and wear masks forever guys. We'll lick this thing. We're all in it together.