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| Post Number: 21
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Malcolm 
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 17 2015,14:09 |
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If someone's up in arms about this, then the government's organ donation push is just as bad. Why did I never heard them complain about that? Do you see hospitals advertising how many lungs they extract from ERs every year?
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 22
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GORDON
90%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 36125
Joined: Jun. 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 17 2015,14:24 |
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People who are grown-ups sign a form saying they consent to be organ donors. The people who are already a little shaky on the "when does life begin?" fence might have a problem with not only (what they see as) babies being killed, but they are also being farmed.
And I know you knew the difference.
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I don't give a fuck!
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| Post Number: 23
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 17 2015,14:35 |
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Farmed? Farming would be if PP stopped handing out condoms. That's the biggest killshot for me in all this. They will, for free, give you some latex that totally undercuts their Illuminati organ farming biz. Where's the PP campaign with a cowboy riding a horse with no saddle above the slogan "It's better bareback?"
EDIT: I'm waiting for the conspiracy theorists who think PP has dudes in the back with needles poking holes in the freebies before repackaging them. With all the cash they make from selling livers, I bet they're millionaires up in that mug.
Edited by Malcolm on Jul. 17 2015,14:41
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 24
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TPRJones
I saw The Fault in our Stars opening night.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 12384
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 17 2015,16:46 |
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(GORDON @ Jul. 17 2015,14:39)
QUOTE Before this event, show of hands, who knew PP was harvesting fetal matter?
*raises hand*
Where did you think the tissue samples that have been driving our medical advancements for decades were coming from? Poultry?
QUOTE Why was this a big secret?
Until this story I wasn't aware it was a secret. When a woman goes to them for an abortion they ask if they would like the tissue to be donated to medical research or not. So at least everyone who's gotten an abortion at PP would know about it. That's a lot of people to be using the word "secret."
As to this making them millionaires, at $30 in handling fees per liver factored against probably between $20 and $40 in storage costs and shipping per liver, at one or two livers per day per clinic (rather high based on the video, actually, as that would only apply to the busiest of clinics, but lets be generous) across their 700 health centers they should clear a million dollars of profit from livers after only infinity years.
Edited by TPRJones on Jul. 17 2015,16:48
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Vidi Perfutui Veni
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| Post Number: 25
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| Post Number: 26
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 21 2015,07:28 |
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(GORDON @ Jul. 21 2015,08:53)
QUOTE There's no point linking the article because the author has an obvious opinion and therefore would be dismissed out of hand as "biased," but I found this particular passage sort of gross: QUOTE A former Planned Parenthood clinic director tells of being mystified that in her clinic various keypads and passwords were set to 2229 — “Spells out ‘baby,’” a staffer helpfully informed her. The garbage truck that hauled away the clinic’s “products of conception” — human scraps — was mockingly referred to by staffers as “the nursery.”
This reminds me of the Satanic abuse stories in the '80s. It's simply too good to be true for one side's agenda. Or should I post all the shit about Haliburton I can find from a decade ago?
Edited by Malcolm on Jul. 21 2015,07:29
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 27
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GORDON
90%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 36125
Joined: Jun. 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 21 2015,07:42 |
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Exactly.
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| Post Number: 28
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 22 2015,10:35 |
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Another article that illustrates why I find this to be overblown.
QUOTE She is alert to market demand — “I’d say a lot of people want liver,” she tells her lunch companions — and understands how to carry out an abortion to maximize the quality of the organs that can be supplied to buyers afterward.
“We’ve been very good at getting heart, lung, liver, because we know that,” says Nucatola, “so I’m not gonna crush that part, I’m gonna basically crush below, I’m gonna crush above, and I’m gonna see if I can get it all intact.” She talks about properly trained abortion doctors using ultrasound to ensure that forceps don’t damage organs destined for sale.
Holy crap. It's almost like she's a trained medical professional that understands the value of one part of the body over another. Sorry she's not reaching in with giant robot hands and doing it less elegantly.
QUOTE On Tuesday, a second undercover video was released. This one shows Dr. Mary Gatter, the president of Planned Parenthood’s medical directors council, haggling over the price for fetal organs. “We’re not in it for the money,” Gatter says; still, the payment “has to be big enough that it’s worthwhile for me.”
Yes, worthwhile to spend time training your staff to do this shit, paying for instruments to do it, paying for equipment and people to transport it. Economics is a harsh mistress and doesn't give a fuck if you're talking about human organs or pipe organs. By the by, $30-100 is a shitty, shitty price for black market organs.
Finally, we get to the moral outrage at the bottom of all this...
QUOTE Even abortion-rights advocates — especially abortion-rights advocates — should insist that abortion and its aftermath be treated with the gravest dignity and respect. For nothing turns hearts and minds against the culture of abortion than its tendency to dehumanize. And could anything be more dehumanizing than the reduction of an unborn baby to its parts?
Uh ... no. Fuck off if you think you get to tell others what is and isn't deserving of reverence in their lives as it relates to their body. There is no subject, no anything, that's so taboo you have to approach it like Job talking to Yahweh.
Edited by Malcolm on Jul. 22 2015,10:38
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 29
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TPRJones
I saw The Fault in our Stars opening night.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 12384
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 22 2015,11:52 |
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I agree somewhat on the dignity and respect angle. The thing is all these videos the Planned Parenthood professionals have been nothing but ... well, professional. It's clear that they are trying to make the best of an unfortunate situation, and trying to find positive uses for these tissues in medical studies is one such step.
The only gleeful jeering I see in these videos comes from the person doing the taping, trying to goad them into saying something untoward.
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Vidi Perfutui Veni
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| Post Number: 30
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Vince
I make sweet, sweet love to my legally licenced copy of Microsoft Vista.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 5016
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 22 2015,11:57 |
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I'm surprised that this is a story, really. What they do is ghoulish. Even without selling the body parts. To me, selling the parts is slightly less ghoulish than running the unborn through a blender.
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| Post Number: 31
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 22 2015,12:15 |
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The alternative to abortion clinics...
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 32
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TPRJones
I saw The Fault in our Stars opening night.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 12384
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 22 2015,18:19 |
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That's only about half the alternative. The other half is children raised by teens who are even more likely to end up also needing abortions later on.
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Vidi Perfutui Veni
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| Post Number: 33
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Vince
I make sweet, sweet love to my legally licenced copy of Microsoft Vista.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 5016
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 23 2015,06:51 |
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I'm telling you, remove some warning labels and this shit would work itself out.
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| Post Number: 34
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GORDON
90%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 36125
Joined: Jun. 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 28 2015,07:36 |
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A third video was released today of a phlebotomist talking about how he was tasked to get the good organs out of the aborted fetuses so PP could make more money.
Just so I am clear, there are intelligent people on this forum who are saying that there is no gray area here, and it is absolutely good that they are harvesting organs? I just want to make sure I am not just being a crank about this.
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| Post Number: 35
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 28 2015,08:20 |
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QUOTE ... phlebotomist talking about how he was tasked to get the good organs out of the aborted fetuses so PP could make more money.
His job is taking blood from veins. Not organs from aborted fetuses.
QUOTE Phlebotomists are people trained to draw blood from a patient for clinical or medical testing, transfusions, donations, or research.
Either the dude doesn't know his job or the vid is fucked. Yet again, they've already admitted it's maybe $100 each. The black market pays more. $100 probably covers transport.
QUOTE and it is absolutely good that they are harvesting organs?
As I said before, we'll throw everything away in a big-ass blender if it makes you feel better. Then they'll get bitched at for that, too.
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 36
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GORDON
90%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 36125
Joined: Jun. 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 28 2015,08:26 |
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(Malcolm @ Jul. 28 2015,11:20)
QUOTE QUOTE ... phlebotomist talking about how he was tasked to get the good organs out of the aborted fetuses so PP could make more money. His job is taking blood from veins. Not organs from aborted fetuses. QUOTE Phlebotomists are people trained to draw blood from a patient for clinical or medical testing, transfusions, donations, or research. Either the dude doesn't know his job or the vid is fucked. Yet again, they've already admitted it's maybe $100 each. The black market pays more. $100 probably covers transport.
In the article I read the dude says he wasn't sure why he was hired for that job since he was a blood doctor, but he was.
And I've met more phlebotomists before I was 30 that you will your whole life, since you are trying to school me. :-D
Edited by GORDON on Jul. 28 2015,08:27
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| Post Number: 37
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 28 2015,08:30 |
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I knew at least a couple people that were or were training to be. Hung out at the plasma cine enough, too.
Edited by Malcolm on Jul. 28 2015,08:30
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 38
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 28 2015,10:14 |
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Douchebags trolling for votes. I pretty much never vote. I would actually go to a polling place for this to make sure funding stays in place.
Edited by Malcolm on Jul. 28 2015,10:14
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 39
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| Post Number: 40
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Vince
I make sweet, sweet love to my legally licenced copy of Microsoft Vista.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 5016
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: Jul. 29 2015,06:30 |
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Okay, the more I'm seeing the more I agree that there needs to be an investigation. From what is said in the video, that are purposely trying profit from the organs (illegal, they can only recoup the costs) and intentionally trying to structure the profits so as not to draw attention.
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