Topic: Gates thing
started by: Troy
Posted by Troy on Jul. 23 2009,09:58
Not one to usually pull up articles that cause as much strife as this one is, but this article actually kind of makes me rather angry about the whole incident.< Smoking gun police reports >
It's getting reported a totally different way by CNN and other news sites.... but here is my line of thinking
Henry Gates returns from a trip to China to find his front door busted, he has to break/force in, looks to a neighbor/passerby like a legit break in.
Cops called, show up, knock on door.
Gates basically starts off the whole thing by responding to basic police requests "step outside to talk to me, show id" by pulling race card, yelling. Not sure where one learns its a good idea to yell at police officers after you know you just had to basically kick your own door in, in the middle of the day.
It deteriorates from there. Cop Ego/Harvard Professor Ego clash and what ends up is Gates on his porch yelling about being a black man in america.
WTF.
What am I missing out of this story that makes it so anti police? I sure hope that regardless of my race, if I(or anyone) kick my own door down and someone sees it, calls the cops, and they show up as quick as they did, they immediately ask for "my" id and what the heck just happened.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 23 2009,10:40
I had a feeling they are both to blame.Cops need to have more patience with irate citizens.
Black professors need to stop being so angry about being held down by the man.
Posted by Mommy Dearest on Jul. 23 2009,11:18
(GORDON @ Jul. 23 2009,13:40)
QUOTE
I had a feeling they are both to blame.
Cops need to have more patience with irate citizens.
Black professors need to stop being so angry about being held down by the man.
Cops need to have more patience with irate citizens.
Black professors need to stop being so angry about being held down by the man.
I wonder how irate I would be if they came into my house to arrest me
Posted by TPRJones on Jul. 23 2009,11:31
Based on the limited information, I'm prepared to blame Gates. Although my own experiences with cops would lead me to suspect the odds are high the cop didn't do anything to try to difuse the situation becuase of a desire to "maintain control". But so far there's no evidence to validate my cynicism in this case.
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 23 2009,11:35
If the cops showed up at my house after I broke into it, I would have Posted by unkbill on Jul. 23 2009,12:20
Should have tazed his ass.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 23 2009,12:42
(Mommy Dearest @ Jul. 23 2009,14:18)
QUOTE
(GORDON @ Jul. 23 2009,13:40)
QUOTE
I had a feeling they are both to blame.
Cops need to have more patience with irate citizens.
Black professors need to stop being so angry about being held down by the man.
Cops need to have more patience with irate citizens.
Black professors need to stop being so angry about being held down by the man.
I wonder how irate I would be if they came into my house to arrest me
Point is, he was uncooperative. All he had to do was prove he wasn't a burglar, and all would have been well. But he had to get all "you're just ehre because I am a black man." Again, I think cops need more patience, but they are both in the wrong.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 23 2009,13:23
Even tech support folk have a "how to deal w\ a pissed off customer" bullshit script somewhere. Cops should at least be held to the same standards as Geek Squad employees. That being said, unless there happened to be a recording device somewhere near by, I don't think we'll ever be assured of what was said. The report makes Gates sound fucking insane. He does work at Harvard, so he's probably a bit brain-damaged anyhow. I don't think he's that insane.What would've been particularly hilarious is a black cop responding to the call. Then what the fuck does he do?
Posted by TPRJones on Jul. 23 2009,15:08
Why, then he would have just been calm and told the cop he lived there and shown his ID and it would have been over with in five minutes, max.Because Gates is racist.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 23 2009,15:59
(TPRJones @ Jul. 23 2009,17:08)
QUOTE
Why, then he would have just been calm and told the cop he lived there and shown his ID and it would have been over with in five minutes, max.
Because Gates is racist.
Because Gates is racist.
The solution is obviously some sort of chameleon-suit.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 23 2009,18:25
(Malcolm @ Jul. 23 2009,18:59)
QUOTE
(TPRJones @ Jul. 23 2009,17:08)
QUOTE
Why, then he would have just been calm and told the cop he lived there and shown his ID and it would have been over with in five minutes, max.
Because Gates is racist.
Because Gates is racist.
The solution is obviously some sort of chameleon-suit.
DOn't remind me of that movie.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 23 2009,22:44
(GORDON @ Jul. 23 2009,20:25)
QUOTE
(Malcolm @ Jul. 23 2009,18:59)
QUOTE
(TPRJones @ Jul. 23 2009,17:08)
QUOTE
Why, then he would have just been calm and told the cop he lived there and shown his ID and it would have been over with in five minutes, max.
Because Gates is racist.
Because Gates is racist.
The solution is obviously some sort of chameleon-suit.
DOn't remind me of that movie.
Movie?
Posted by TPRJones on Jul. 24 2009,05:17
Posted by Troy on Jul. 24 2009,06:17
I dont' think I saw that movie, or If it is, then I saw only parts of it that didn't look anything like that.Also, after 24 hours, the blame and points have shifted dramatically on the major news networks. Now it's just stories about how good the cop was, how he taught racial profiling classes, etc. Given enough time this one is gonna blow up in the Presidents face... shame too, he could have just been quiet, the less people involved with this, the better.
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 24 2009,06:25
Scanner Darkly?
Posted by Troy on Jul. 24 2009,07:01
Yeah, that was my guess.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 24 2009,07:57
(TheCatt @ Jul. 24 2009,09:25)
QUOTE
Scanner Darkly?
Yes. I was blanking on the name of it.
Part of it was tht there were these chameleon suits available... and Keanu Reeves as a cop was actually assigned to investigate himself for drug trafficking because the anonymity was too perfect.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 24 2009,08:13
Never saw the movie or read the book.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 24 2009,08:21
Never read the book, and "got" about half the movie because I just don't understand the glamor of bad drug trips.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 24 2009,08:30
< Dig the hole deeper >.QUOTE
Obama said he had heard of Crowley's record, saying, "I don't know all the extenuating circumstances, and as I said, I respect what police officers do. From what I can tell, the sergeant who was involved is an outstanding police officer, but my suspicion is probably it would have been better if cooler heads prevailed."
Huh? You just praised & slammed the same person in the same sentence. Unless the implication is the cop is correct & your friend is a fuckwit.
QUOTE
"This is not about me; this is about the vulnerability of black men in America," he [Gates] said this week.
WHAT?
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 24 2009,08:50
"Michelle hates white people, the cop was wight, do the math. I won. Let me be clear."
Posted by Troy on Jul. 24 2009,08:57
(GORDON @ Jul. 24 2009,08:50)
QUOTE
"Michelle hates white people, the cop was wight, do the math. I won. Let me be clear."
In before you edit it.
But that would solve all of our problems...
"Excuse me sir can i see your ID"
"YAAAAAA"
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 24 2009,09:44
(Troy @ Jul. 24 2009,11:57)
QUOTE
(GORDON @ Jul. 24 2009,08:50)
QUOTE
"Michelle hates white people, the cop was wight, do the math. I won. Let me be clear."
In before you edit it.
Heh. Late night, had just woken up :-D
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 24 2009,10:01
No, Gates. It's ALL about you.And, Obama - just apologize and move past it. We don't care about your suspicions.
Posted by TPRJones on Jul. 24 2009,10:19
From < here >:QUOTE
Another data point: I’ve got an (left-wing, Cantabridgian) employee who used to serve the guy coffee every morning at an independent coffeehouse near Harvard’s campus … and the guy says that Gates is a self-satisfied blow-hard.
QUOTE
I can add a second data point to your employee’s data point. A year ago I worked at a research institute where he was a fellow. He didn’t show up that often, but when he did he pretty much expected everyone to drop everything to cater to him. Whenever he walked by our office he used to bang, loudly, on our window. Not in a friendly, “Hi, how are ya!” kind of way, but in a “Skip Gates has arrived, acknowledge me!” kind of way.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 24 2009,11:03
Most tenured & research professors I've met are complete dickheads. That cuts across every discipline, too -- the arts, sciences, & everything in between.As their salaries increase, so does their level of dickheadedness.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 24 2009,13:54
Why the fuck does he have an opinion, anyway? He had no knowledge about what happened, and he still has something to say about it. Same as that coup or whatever in Central America, recently. Christ.< http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=8163051&page=1 >
Posted by thibodeaux on Jul. 24 2009,14:17
It's hard for me to pick a side here: race hustler vs. cop. Normally I'd side against race hustler, but all to often a charge of "disorderly conduct" is simply a charge of "contempt of cop." < See here >:QUOTE
Sgt. Crowley was understandably carrying out his duty to investigate the report, and from the quotes attributed to Gates, the professor was unfair in his comments to an officer doing a good job. But being rude, unfair, or disrespectful should not be illegal, and that’s essentially the effect of most disorderly conduct laws. Our American society increasingly hands more responsibility and control to the great Nanny State. Heightened arrests under disorderly conduct laws enable this frightening progression.
President Obama would have been wise to avoid this controversy, particularly since he admits to lacking all of the facts. But ultimately I cannot disagree with the thrust of his statement. Arresting Prof. Gates under the circumstances was stupid and Americans in every state would do well to scale back the reach of disorderly conduct laws.
President Obama would have been wise to avoid this controversy, particularly since he admits to lacking all of the facts. But ultimately I cannot disagree with the thrust of his statement. Arresting Prof. Gates under the circumstances was stupid and Americans in every state would do well to scale back the reach of disorderly conduct laws.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 24 2009,14:19
"But being rude, unfair, or disrespectful should not be illegal, and that’s essentially the effect of most disorderly conduct laws. "I've been saying from the beginning, the cop should have had more patience. Being rude to a cop shouldn't even be close to an arrestable offense. But it is, and the race pimp shouldn't have been such a dick.
Posted by TPRJones on Jul. 25 2009,07:34
I have no doubt that Gates was a douche. But once his identity and right to be there were confirmed, why didn’t the cop just leave? Why did he feel compelled to remain there and cause the incident to continue to escalate? Was he trying to “control the situation”?I really hate that phrase. Just about every story I hear these days about a cop crossing the line has involved that phrase. That is a phrase that has absolutely no place coming out of the mouth of an authority figure in a free society.
Posted by Cakedaddy on Jul. 25 2009,14:12
I got the impression he was leaving. And Gates was following him outside. At which point, he was arrested. I didn't get the impression that the cop was lingering, other than due to the fact that Gates was 'raging' on him. I also got the impression that Gates took his time showing his ID, which made the officer stay there longer than needed.
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 25 2009,16:35
I had the same understanding as Cake.
Posted by Mommy Dearest on Jul. 26 2009,20:22
And today Gates asked that the matter be over and to please "move on" Mighty White?
Posted by unkbill on Jul. 27 2009,04:55
(Malcolm @ Jul. 24 2009,11:03)
QUOTE
Most tenured & research professors I've met are complete dickheads. That cuts across every discipline, too -- the arts, sciences, & everything in between.
As their salaries increase, so does their level of dickheadedness.
As their salaries increase, so does their level of dickheadedness.
I don't doubt you one bit. I worked for such a person last friday. Had the back door on his 100+ year old mansion tore out when he informs me that the door on my truck is the wrong one. All I can say is that is the one the lumber company built for you and told me to hang.
I explain to him we are pretty much out of options. Install the wrong door and fix it later or plywood the hole up. 45 minutes later he decides to install the door. I'm billing him for the time.
At first he was starting to help us. Taking out screws with a screwdriver instead of letting me in with my drill. I was ready to explain to him my pay rate when he stopped. X dollars on hour. XX if you watch me work. XXX if you help me work.
Posted by Troy on Jul. 27 2009,12:02
As the page turns:So the lady who called in released < a statement >. On her 911 call she never said black suspects. Of course, she called one of them "big and maybe hispanic" but whatever. Actually that's funny, because her laywer said "She didn't see their race" just their behavior... except for the part where she said one was Hispanic... BUT OTHER THAN THAT... she didnt see race.
Also says she never talked to the officer at the scene, like it says in the police reports. (Edit: I guess the officer could have talked to the old woman who told the original lady to call the cops?)
This whole incident is just one big crock of shit after another.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 27 2009,13:29
If I was the white cop I'd have declined the offer to meet with Obama.. because that would have been hilarious.
Posted by Vince on Jul. 27 2009,15:55
(TheCatt @ Jul. 25 2009,18:35)
QUOTE
I had the same understanding as Cake.
Ditto. These people need to watch more episodes of COPS.
Posted by Malcolm on Jul. 30 2009,10:24
< I'd kill to drink at this table >.QUOTE
The president will drink Bud Light, Gates will have Red Stripe, and Crowley will drink Blue Moon
Based on their choices of beer, I'm now forced to side w\ Crowley. The prez drinks Clydesdale piss.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 30 2009,11:13
I bet his advisers said NO MALT LIQUOR.
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 30 2009,18:10
I bet his advisers said "Drink something American."Oooops.
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 30 2009,19:55
Good thing < this officer > wasn't the one there.QUOTE
Barrett, a two-year veteran of the Boston police force and a member of the National Guard, sent an e-mail to the Boston Globe and fellow Guard members in response to a July 22 Globe column about Gates' controversial arrest earlier this month.
Gates, a top African-American scholar, was arrested on July 16 and accused of disorderly conduct after police responded to a report of a possible break-in at his Boston-area home. The charge was later dropped. The incident sparked a debate about racial profiling and police procedures.
Globe columnist Yvonne Abraham supported Gates' actions, asking readers, "Would you stand for this kind of treatment, in your own home, by a police officer who by now clearly has no right to be there?"
In Barrett's e-mail, which was posted on a Boston television station's Web site, he declared that if he had "been the officer he verbally assaulted like a banana-eating jungle monkey, I would have sprayed him in the face with OC [oleoresin capsicum, or pepper spray] deserving of his belligerent noncompliance."
Barrett used the "jungle monkey" phrase four times, three times referring to Gates and once referring to Abraham's writing as "jungle monkey gibberish."
He also declared that he was "not a racist but I am prejudice [sic] towards people who are stupid and pretend to stand up and preach for something they say is freedom but it is merely attention because you do not get enough of it in your little fear-dwelling circle of on-the-bandwagon followers."
Marano said Wednesday that Barrett's comments were taken out of context.
"Officer Barrett did not call professor Gates a jungle monkey or malign him racially," Marano said. "He said his behavior was like that of one. It was a characterization of the actions of that man."
Gates, a top African-American scholar, was arrested on July 16 and accused of disorderly conduct after police responded to a report of a possible break-in at his Boston-area home. The charge was later dropped. The incident sparked a debate about racial profiling and police procedures.
Globe columnist Yvonne Abraham supported Gates' actions, asking readers, "Would you stand for this kind of treatment, in your own home, by a police officer who by now clearly has no right to be there?"
In Barrett's e-mail, which was posted on a Boston television station's Web site, he declared that if he had "been the officer he verbally assaulted like a banana-eating jungle monkey, I would have sprayed him in the face with OC [oleoresin capsicum, or pepper spray] deserving of his belligerent noncompliance."
Barrett used the "jungle monkey" phrase four times, three times referring to Gates and once referring to Abraham's writing as "jungle monkey gibberish."
He also declared that he was "not a racist but I am prejudice [sic] towards people who are stupid and pretend to stand up and preach for something they say is freedom but it is merely attention because you do not get enough of it in your little fear-dwelling circle of on-the-bandwagon followers."
Marano said Wednesday that Barrett's comments were taken out of context.
"Officer Barrett did not call professor Gates a jungle monkey or malign him racially," Marano said. "He said his behavior was like that of one. It was a characterization of the actions of that man."
Posted by Mommy Dearest on Jul. 30 2009,20:02
(TheCatt @ Jul. 30 2009,22:55)
QUOTE
Good thing < this officer > wasn't the one there.
QUOTE
Barrett, a two-year veteran of the Boston police force and a member of the National Guard, sent an e-mail to the Boston Globe and fellow Guard members in response to a July 22 Globe column about Gates' controversial arrest earlier this month.
Gates, a top African-American scholar, was arrested on July 16 and accused of disorderly conduct after police responded to a report of a possible break-in at his Boston-area home. The charge was later dropped. The incident sparked a debate about racial profiling and police procedures.
Globe columnist Yvonne Abraham supported Gates' actions, asking readers, "Would you stand for this kind of treatment, in your own home, by a police officer who by now clearly has no right to be there?"
In Barrett's e-mail, which was posted on a Boston television station's Web site, he declared that if he had "been the officer he verbally assaulted like a banana-eating jungle monkey, I would have sprayed him in the face with OC [oleoresin capsicum, or pepper spray] deserving of his belligerent noncompliance."
Barrett used the "jungle monkey" phrase four times, three times referring to Gates and once referring to Abraham's writing as "jungle monkey gibberish."
He also declared that he was "not a racist but I am prejudice [sic] towards people who are stupid and pretend to stand up and preach for something they say is freedom but it is merely attention because you do not get enough of it in your little fear-dwelling circle of on-the-bandwagon followers."
Marano said Wednesday that Barrett's comments were taken out of context.
"Officer Barrett did not call professor Gates a jungle monkey or malign him racially," Marano said. "He said his behavior was like that of one. It was a characterization of the actions of that man."
Gates, a top African-American scholar, was arrested on July 16 and accused of disorderly conduct after police responded to a report of a possible break-in at his Boston-area home. The charge was later dropped. The incident sparked a debate about racial profiling and police procedures.
Globe columnist Yvonne Abraham supported Gates' actions, asking readers, "Would you stand for this kind of treatment, in your own home, by a police officer who by now clearly has no right to be there?"
In Barrett's e-mail, which was posted on a Boston television station's Web site, he declared that if he had "been the officer he verbally assaulted like a banana-eating jungle monkey, I would have sprayed him in the face with OC [oleoresin capsicum, or pepper spray] deserving of his belligerent noncompliance."
Barrett used the "jungle monkey" phrase four times, three times referring to Gates and once referring to Abraham's writing as "jungle monkey gibberish."
He also declared that he was "not a racist but I am prejudice [sic] towards people who are stupid and pretend to stand up and preach for something they say is freedom but it is merely attention because you do not get enough of it in your little fear-dwelling circle of on-the-bandwagon followers."
Marano said Wednesday that Barrett's comments were taken out of context.
"Officer Barrett did not call professor Gates a jungle monkey or malign him racially," Marano said. "He said his behavior was like that of one. It was a characterization of the actions of that man."
Is that officer still employed?
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 30 2009,20:21
If there's one thing that wont be tolerated around here, it's free speech.
Posted by thibodeaux on Jul. 31 2009,04:08
< http://www.xkcd.com/617/ >
Posted by Troy on Jul. 31 2009,06:24
Tequila is baaaad
Posted by TheCatt on Jul. 31 2009,15:12
(thibodeaux @ Jul. 31 2009,07:08)
QUOTE
< http://www.xkcd.com/617/ >
LOL
Gordon - Shut it, cracker.
Posted by Mommy Dearest on Jul. 31 2009,18:25
(GORDON @ Jul. 30 2009,23:21)
QUOTE
If there's one thing that wont be tolerated around here, it's free speech.
They don't call them public servants for nothing.
Posted by GORDON on Jul. 31 2009,19:21
(TheCatt @ Jul. 31 2009,18:12)
QUOTE
(thibodeaux @ Jul. 31 2009,07:08)
QUOTE
< http://www.xkcd.com/617/ >
LOL
Gordon - Shut it, cracker.
Help! Help! I'm being oppressed! Come see the violence inherent in the system!
Posted by TheCatt on Aug. 01 2009,06:16
Please, only white on black violence in inherent in the system.