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Leisher 
Top 3%, yo.
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 26651
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 07 2010,11:43 |
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I really pissed someone off at lunch Wednesday when I bashed the Catholic church for their cover up of priests molesting little boys. In my humble opinion, there is no defense for it. The church is flawed and committed a terrible crime against children and their families all over the planet.
The latest pope stepping up to admit the cover up, and IF they decide to kick the offending priests out of the church (why are they even debating this?) would be nice steps towards healing and regaining some credibility.
Another great move would be to allow their priests to have sex and get married, but that's for another day.
Anyway the pope signaling a major shift towards reality for the Catholic Church, but as Penn Gillette says "And then there's this asshole!"
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| Post Number: 2
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 07 2010,13:48 |
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(Leisher @ May 07 2010,13:43)
QUOTE
The fact that complete loons like that are allowed to hold some of the highest offices in that organization undermines  any moral authority they claim to have (if they had that much to begin with).  If they had their way, they'd still be converting by the sword, holding inquisitions, and executing heretics.  Till they open up the Vatican archives & make public all their secret materials, they can suck my balls.
Edited by Malcolm on May 07 2010,13:49
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 3
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TheCatt
Top 2%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 22951
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 07 2010,14:48 |
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I really don't get much about people joining organized religions.
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It's not me, it's someone else.
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| Post Number: 4
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 07 2010,14:55 |
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(TheCatt @ May 07 2010,16:48)
QUOTE I really don't get much about people joining organized religions.
It's almost always easier to let someone else tell you how to live instead of deciding for yourself. If it turns out to be wrong, you can blame them instead of admitting your own fuck up.
QUOTE "Who's more foolish : the fool or the fool who follows?"
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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Vince
I make sweet, sweet love to my legally licenced copy of Microsoft Vista.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 5016
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 09 2010,05:45 |
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Catholics have been heavily targetted. Not that the church didn't screw the pooch in their handling of the incidents, but there are much higher rates of molestation among your kids' teachers than there are among priests.
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| Post Number: 7
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Leisher
Top 3%, yo.
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 26651
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 09 2010,07:56 |
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QUOTE Catholics have been heavily targetted.
To be fair, it's not Catholics, it's the Catholic Church. I don't think the people who follow the religion condone this behavior.
This is a criticism of the church organization, not the folks who are members.
QUOTE Not that the church didn't screw the pooch in their handling of the incidents, but there are much higher rates of molestation among your kids' teachers than there are among priests.
Schools aren't covering it up and retaining the offending teachers. They also aren't giving them access to other kids.
That part is the key to why people are bashing the church so hard. Because maybe teachers do molest more kids, but it doesn't matter because when they're caught, they're punished. They're not just relocated and hidden.
And in all honesty, even if you had numbers to prove teachers molest more kids, you should know that even the stat experts say the numbers are most likely wrong. Why? Well, the big unknown about the church scandal is how many kids didn't come forward. Most people don't like stepping in front of the whole world and declaring "I was molested." Plus, it's important to remember that we only hear about stuff in the U.S. How many kids have been molested by priests in other countries? (And to keep it fair, teachers?)
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| Post Number: 8
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GORDON
90%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 36125
Joined: Jun. 2004
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Posted on: May 09 2010,08:01 |
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And the U.N.
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I don't give a fuck!
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| Post Number: 9
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Vince
I make sweet, sweet love to my legally licenced copy of Microsoft Vista.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 5016
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 09 2010,15:22 |
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(Leisher @ May 09 2010,09:56)
QUOTE Schools aren't covering it up and retaining the offending teachers. They also aren't giving them access to other kids.
Um... yes they are.
http://post-gazette.com/regionstate/19991031newabuse1.asp
QUOTE
And in all honesty, even if you had numbers to prove teachers molest more kids, you should know that even the stat experts say the numbers are most likely wrong. Why? Well, the big unknown about the church scandal is how many kids didn't come forward. Most people don't like stepping in front of the whole world and declaring "I was molested." Plus, it's important to remember that we only hear about stuff in the U.S. How many kids have been molested by priests in other countries? (And to keep it fair, teachers?)
And the things that might influence a kid to NOT come forward if molested by a priest aren't in play when molested by a teacher? If anything, I'd say the kid molested by the teacher is even less likely to come forward than the kid molested by the priest. The kid molested by the priest has maybe a handful of people at church that know him. The kid molested by the teacher risks all his peers finding out.
But my point was more about the media than anything. The church is evil.
Teachers are part of the state and the state is good and caring and all knowing and providing. And when they touch your pee-pee it's because they really, really care.
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| Post Number: 10
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 10 2010,07:43 |
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QUOTE The kid molested by the priest has maybe a handful of people at church that know him. The kid molested by the teacher risks all his peers finding out.
Maybe a handful? Maybe the kid at school has a really small class or something. You're arguing over which is worse by how many people find out about it?
QUOTE TeachersPriests are partservants of the stategod and the stategod is good and caring and all knowing and providing. And when they touch your pee-pee it's because they really, really care.
Reads pretty much the same to me.
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 11
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Leisher
Top 3%, yo.
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 26651
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 10 2010,12:44 |
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QUOTE Um... yes they are. http://post-gazette.com/regionstate/19991031newabuse1.asp[/QUOTE]Good find, but these are different animals. I absolutely agree that certain folks are going to have gotten lighter sentences or got caught without a ton of evidence allowing them to do it again. However a single authority is not making the call to move them from school to school and orchestrating a huge cover up. QUOTE And the things that might influence a kid to NOT come forward if molested by a priest aren't in play when molested by a teacher? If anything, I'd say the kid molested by the teacher is even less likely to come forward than the kid molested by the priest. The kid molested by the priest has maybe a handful of people at church that know him. The kid molested by the teacher risks all his peers finding out. I completely disagree with this one for a few reasons. 1. A lot of the molesting teachers are female. As we've been seeing the young boys molested by them are always out bragging about it. That's how they get caught. IE: The molested kid(s) isn't too worried about what their peers think. (And if you want to talk about unfair treatment by the MSM and society, look no further than female teachers who molest students.) 2. I totally disagree with your reasoning where the kid would worry about who is going to find out. Unless the kid is going to another town for worship, he most likely is going to a church within his own neighborhood/community. That kid isn't trying to rationalize who will find out, they're thinking EVERYONE is going to find out. 3. God. A teacher is an adult that instructs you in science, math, history, etc. A priest is a man spreading the word of God. Compare the two in most communities and you'll find the priest is far more respected and trusted (right or wrong). Kids in religious families are constantly told about God and his powers. they're taken to church every Sunday and watch their parents get lectured by this man. Do you honestly think they'd be more afraid to tell someone their teacher touched them inappropriately then their priest? QUOTE Teachers are part of the state and the state is good and caring and all knowing and providing. And when they touch your pee-pee it's because they really, really care. Malcolm's response pretty much sums up what I was going to say. Again Vince, I'm not attacking the religion or those that follow it. I'm attacking the organization behind the religion. And honestly, trying to compare molestations and their cover ups at schools and at churches is ridiculously silly. Both are horrific and indefensible. Neither is better or worse than the other. Maybe the MSM is covering one or the other unfairly, but that doesn't justify anything. The Catholic Church was wrong, and even the pope admits it. Any schools doing the same are also wrong. End of story.
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| Post Number: 12
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Vince
I make sweet, sweet love to my legally licenced copy of Microsoft Vista.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 5016
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 10 2010,18:10 |
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Leisher, I don't disagree with the points you're making about the church screwing up at all. The point I'm making is that 69% of molestation of kids occurs by someone that's somehow involved with the kids school (teachers, teachers aids, bus drivers), and what do we know about that? Kind of like how more toddlers die by drowning in 5 gallon buckets of water every year than by accidental shootings, but the media is going to make the guns out to be a bigger threat to your kids.
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| Post Number: 13
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TPRJones
I saw The Fault in our Stars opening night.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 12384
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 11 2010,07:09 |
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(GORDON @ May 07 2010,17:15)
QUOTE
(TheCatt @ May 07 2010,17:48)
QUOTE I really don't get much about people joining organized religions. The entire concept is baffling to me, but talking about it just results in hurt feelings so better to keep my mouth shut.
Fuck that noise. I'll call an asshole and asshole when I see 'em. Same goes for idiots. If I piss off a a friend enough to no longer be friends, then they weren't worth having as friends in the first place.
I keep my tongue in check at work, but then so do the religious nuts I have working around me. If they start proselytizing, I will start criticizing. Until then I will accept an uneasy truce in return for a paycheck.
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Vidi Perfutui Veni
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Cakedaddy
Group: "Members"
Posts: 6241
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 11 2010,09:28 |
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And that's all the church does. . . pay for people to be pedos.
Take out the religious part, and churches still do a lot of good for communities, etc. Yes, they have their fair share of corruption, psychos, etc. To say that every religious person is evil simply because a few of them are idiots is dumb. But I'm not pissed at all Catholics because they funded an organization that had pedos. That's just ridiculous.
That being said, I do hold the church/pastors/priests to a higher standard than I do teachers, etc. So, yes, I expect more from them and feel it's worse when a priest molests a child than when a teacher does it. The crime is the same, but the breech of trust is greater with the priest, in my opinion. I would have expected more from the church than for them to protect their bottom line.
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| Post Number: 16
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TheCatt
Top 2%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 22951
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 11 2010,09:44 |
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Nah, Thib just memorizes everything. He was on Jeopardy, dontchaknow?
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It's not me, it's someone else.
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| Post Number: 18
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Malcolm
I disagree.
Group: Privateers
Posts: 27168
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 11 2010,10:27 |
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I simply must see that episode if it still exists.
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Diogenes of Sinope:
"It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours."
"Other dogs bite only their enemies, whereas I bite also my friends in order to save them."
Arnold Judas Rimmer, BSC, SSC:
"Better dead than smeg."
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| Post Number: 19
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| Post Number: 20
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TheCatt
Top 2%
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 22951
Joined: May 2004
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Posted on: May 11 2010,11:48 |
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Crap, maybe I wasn't supposed to tell everyone.
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It's not me, it's someone else.
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